Dan, "Okay, then if that answer is yes, as you have said, then does this not conflict with the idea that spirits "know nothing"?

Joel, "Let me point to Ecclesiastes chapter 9 verse 5  for your the answer to this question. It says, For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing , neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten. And again in Ecclesiastes, this same chapter, chapter 9, but verse 10,  Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave, whither thou goest. Your question here should answer itself. Those spirits, which have understanding, and could have proclamation given to them, can not be human kind. Human kind is not a spirit, but has a spirit which returns to God, not to the ground, nor hell. When they die, they, we, know nothing. Time is not an issue. Understanding is not possible. We are dead.  These Spirits, angels, are not dead. They live. They understand. So the answer to this question is there is no conflict. Because, in reality your talking about two different things."

Dan, " Relating to 1 Pet 3:18 and what you have said, the following questions come to mind. First, the verse speaks also of "those who disobeyed in the days of Noah while the ark was being built", isn't this in reference to the disobedient humans at that time? Secondly why was it necessary to preach to the "spirits in prison"?  If they are fallen angels, what benefit is that preaching to them? And thirdly, how does 1 Peter 3:18 relate to 1 Peter 4:6 which it says,
For this is the reason the gospel was preached even to those who are now dead , so that they might be judged according to men in regard to the body, but live according to God in regard to the spirit. Aren't the subjects being preached at on 4:6 same as those in 3:18?  If so, isn't 4:6 speaking of humans as the subjects?

Joel, I am going to have to answer in parts, because I want to give you a full answer And I don't want all this to get confusing. So your first question is, "those who disobeyed in the days of Noah while the ark was being built", isn't this in reference to the disobedient humans at that time? Is that right?"

Dan, "Yes, that's right."

Joel, "Angels are called "spirits" as Psalm 104:4 shows us. It says, Who maketh his angels spirits; his ministers a flaming fire:. Hebrews 1:7 and 14 also show the same things. In Hebrews 1:7: it says, And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire. Along with that same idea, Hebrews 1:14says, Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation? Spirits are created by God. That there was a fall of the angels is certain from Jude 6. Remember Jude 1:6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day. The nature of their fall is clearly stated in the same verse. They left their own oiketerion. This word occurs only in 1 other place in scriptures. 2Corinthians 5:2  For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven: Where it is used of the spiritual, or resurrection body.  The nature of their sin is stated to be "in like manner" to that of the subsequent sins of Sodom and Gomorrha, Jude 7. The time of their fall is given as having taken place "in the days of Noah" which you can see in 1Peter 3:20  and also 2Peter 2:7 where it says, And delivered just Lot, vexed with the filthy conversation of the wicked:, though there may have been a prior fall which caused the end of "the world that then was", being in Genesis 1:1,2. Genesis 1:1 says, In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth.
Gen 1:2: Now, the earth, had become waste and wild, and darkness, was on the face of the roaring deep,—but, the Spirit of God, was brooding on the face of the waters, ...Along together with  2Peter 3:6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished. .
For this sin they are "reserved unto judgement", 2Peter 2:4 For if God didn't spare angels when they sinned, but cast them down to Tartarus, and committed them to pits of darkness, to be reserved to judgment, ... and are "in prison", 1Peter 3:19 In which, even unto the spirits in prison, he went and proclaimed,.. . Their progeny, called Nephilim, translated "giants" in many English translations, were monsters of iniquity; and being superhuman in size and character, had to be destroyed. This was the one and only object of the Flood.

Only Noah and his family had preserved their pedigree pure from Adam. All the rest had become "corrupt", the Greek being shachath, destroyed as Adamites. The only remedy was to destroy it de facto, as it had become destroyed de jure. It is the same word in verse 17 as in verses 11,12.  This irruption of fallen angels was Satan's first attempt to prevent the coming of the Seed of the woman foretold in Genesis 3:15. If this could be accomplished, God's Word would have failed, and his own doom would be averted.

As soon as it was made known that the Seed of the woman was to come through ABRAHAM, there must have been another irruption, as recorded in Genesis 6:4, "and also after that", that is to say, after the days of Noah, more than 500 years after the first irruption. The aim of the enemy was to occupy Canaan in advance of Abraham, and so to contest its occupation by his seed. For, when Abraham entered Canaan, we read in Genesis 12:6"the Canaanite was then, that is to say, already in the land." In the same chapter, Genesis 12:10-20, we see Satan's next attempt to interfere with Abraham's seed, and frustrate the purpose of God that it should be in "Isaac". This attempt was repeated in 20:1-18. The irruption of "the fallen angels", the sons of God, was the first attempt; and was directed against the whole human race.

The progeny of the fallen angels with the daughters of Adam are called in Genesis 6, N e-phil´-im, which means fallen ones, from naphal, to fall. They could not be the sons of Seth as some might thing, What these beings were can be gathered only from Scripture. They were evidently great in size, as well as great in wickedness. They were superhuman, abnormal beings; and their destruction was necessary for the preservation of the human race, and for the faithfulness of Jehovah's Word as it is said in Genesis 3:15.

This was why the Flood was brought "upon the world of the ungodly" as 2Peter 2:5 shows. And as prophesied by Enoch, which was written about in Jude 1:14.  We read of the Nephilim again in Numbers 13:33 : "there we saw the Nephilim, the sons of Anak, which come of the Nephilim". How, it may be asked, could this be, if they were all destroyed in the Flood ? The answer is contained in Genesis 6:4, where we read: "There were Nephilim in the earth in those days, which is to say, in the days of Noah. But notice something else. It says, and also AFTER THAT, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became the mighty men, the Hebrew word is gibbor, which means the heroes, which were of old, men of renown". Literally, men of the name, that is to say, who got a name and were renowned for their ungodliness. So that "after that", that is to say, after the Flood, there was a second irruption of these fallen angels, evidently smaller in number and more limited in area, for they were for the most part confined to Canaan, and were in fact known as "the nations of Canaan". It was for the destruction of these, that the sword of Israel was necessary, as the Flood had been before.
As to the date of this second irruption, it was evidently soon after it became known that the seed was to come through Abraham; for, when he came out from Haran in Genesis 12:6 and entered Canaan, the significant fact is stated: "The Canaanite was then, that is to say, already in the land." And in Genesis 14:5, they were already known as "Rephaim" and "Emim", and had established themselves as Ashteroth Karnaim and Shaveh Kiriathaim.
In chapter 15:18-21 they are enumerated and named among Canaanite Peoples: "Kenites, and the Kenizzites, and the Kadmonites, and the Hittites, and the Perizzites, and the Rephaims, and the Amorites, and the Girgases, and the Jebusites". You can compare Genesis 15:19-21; and Exodus 3:8,17; 23:23. and Deuteronomy 7; 20:17. and even Joshua 12:8.
These were to be cut off, and driven out, and utterly destroyed as it is said in Deuteronomy 20:17. and Joshua 3:10. But Israel failed in this as Joshua 13:13; 15:63; 16:10; 17:18. and Judges 1:19,20,28,29,30-36; 2:1-5; 3:1-7 show. And certainly we know not how many got away to other countries to escape the general destruction. Because we know that something happens in the end times, where something is mingled with the seed of men. If this were recognized it would go far to solve many problems connected with Anthropology. Now as to their other names, they were called Anakim, from one Anak which came of the Nephilim as in Numbers 13:23, and Rephaim, from Rapha, another notable one among them. From Deuteronomy 2:10, they were known by some as Emim, and Horim, and Zamzummim which is in verse 20,21, and Avim..

As Rephaim they were well known, and are often mentioned: but, unfortunately, instead of this, their proper name, being preserved, it is variously translated as "dead", "deceased", or "giants". These Rephaim are to have no resurrection. This fact is stated in Isaiah 26:14 where the proper name is rendered "deceased", and verse 19, where it is rendered "the dead". It is rendered "dead" seven times. In Job 26:5. Psalm 88:10. Proverbs 2:18; 9:18; 21:16. Isaiah 14:8; 26:19. It is rendered "deceased" in Isaiah 26:14. It is retained as proper name "Rephaim" ten times.  Twice being in the margin. Genesis 14:5; 15:20. Joshua 12:15 which is in the margin, 2Samuel 5:18,22; 23:13. 1Chronicles 11:15; 14:9; 20:4 which is also in the margin. And Isaiah 17:5.  In all other places it is rendered "giants" , Genesis 6:4, Numbers 23:33, where it is Nephilim; and Job 16:14, where it is gibbor.  It is certain that the second irruption took place before Genesis 14, for there the Rephaim were mixed up with the five nations or peoples, which included Sodom and Gomorrha, and were defeated by the four kings under Chedorlaomer. Their principal locality was evidently "Ashtaroth Karnaim"; while the Emim were in the plain of Kiriathaim which you can read in Genesis 14:5. Anak was a noted descendant of the Nephilim; and Rapha was another, giving their names respectively to different clans. Anak's father was Arba, the original builder of Hebron in Genesis 35:27. Joshau 15:13; 21:11; and this Palestine branch of the Anakim was not called Abrahim after him, but Anakim after Anak. They were great, mighty, and tall  as you can search out in Deuteronomy 2:10,11,21,22,23; 9:2. Evidently inspiring the ten spies with great fear as it shows in Numbers 12:33. Og king of Bashan is described in Deuteronomy 3:11

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Their strength is seen in "the giant cities of Bashan" to-day; and we know not how far they may have been utilized by Egypt in the construction of buildings, which is still an unsolved problem. Arba was rebuilt by the Khabiri or confederates seven years before Zoan was built by Egyptian Pharoahs of the nineteenth dynasty. If these Nephilim, and their branch of Rephaim, were associated with Egypt, we have an explanation of the problem which has for ages perplexed all engineers, as to how those huge stones and monuments were brought together. Why not in Egypt as well as in "the giant cities of Bashan" which exist, as such, to this day?

Moreover, we have in these mighty men, the "men of renown," the explanation of the origin of the Greek mythology. That mythology was no mere invention of the human brain, but it grew out of the traditions, and memories, and legends of the doings of that mighty race of beings; and was gradually evolved out of the "heroes" of Genesis 6:4. The fact that they were supernatural in their origin formed an easy step to their being regarded as the demi-gods of the Greeks.
Thus the Babylonian "Creation Tablets", the Egyptian "Book of the dead", the Greek mythology, and heathen Cosmogonies, which by some are set on an equality with Scripture, or by others adduced in support of it, are all the corruption and perversion of primitive truths, distorted in proportion as their origin was forgotten, and their memories faded away.

So, your first question, Those in the day of Noah that disobeyed was in deed spirits, fallen angels. There was no resurrection at that time. Humans did not and do not have Spiritual bodies.  Humans are not a spirit, but have a spirit, which is considerable different. When Jesus calls, then you will have that body.

Tommy, "Interesting. Very interesting. Yes, indeed. There is a lot to take in here. And I amazed at the things that I have missed. But, listening to you, there was something that you said that I didn't understand. You used the words de jure, and de facto. What in the world is that?"

Ain't that life 5